Jo O'Brien

I suggest finding where they live and do a “run through”

Nah, just kidding,

I imagine the people that do that sort of thing do so as to get a reaction, I’d suggest to report it and not bubblemail them back at all (an ignore button would be a nice addition)

One question, how come I never get any of these? cue the onslaught LOL

Just ignore them. Seriously you are obviously dealing with little kids.

I guess I worry about other people who don’t take it as well as I do, and what can be done to help them?

Write a journal saying you’re leaving Red Bubble, then everyone wants to be your friend. :)
All joking aside
I have seen evidence of one Bubbler making what they thought was a witty remark, (I thought it was harmless). on a rather risqué image . This person took offence and sent a rather disgusting and rabid BMail to this Bubbler and then wrote a journal about inappropriate comments on journals.
It was hypocrisy of the highest order.
These days I only believe it if it happens to me or I see proof and can decide myself.
There always seems to be a distinct lack of proof.

haha. Good point. Some people do like to overreact for a bit of attention don’t they?

I think your tactic is the correct approach. I really do not see why anyone would be like that to begin with. I actually have not been bothered by anyone…hmmm….want to harass me Jo? lol I did however get a comment about god recently which I found a little surprising. So I am waiting Jo if you care to harass me…lol

Oh Holly, I just don’t have it in me and I loves ya too much :)

It’s awful that you have had this experience, Jo. I guess when your art pushes boundaries there’s a chance it will happen but it should never happen and it’s in no way your fault. This is an art website – in all art’s manifestations. If people don’t like what they see all they need to do is click (or click on the filter!).

Having said that, I have been, unfortunately, fairly experienced receiving bullying and also the processes that go with it. Your last question, the bad treatment does not have to be a series to be bullying. They only need to be threatening once for it to be bullying and this should ALWAYS be reported.

In real life bullying, mediation usually takes place. I think there is dubious success in mediation but it still needs to be a part of the process if only to get to the root of the problem.

If nothing is resolved at mediation, then warnings are generally issued, and in a work situation this can lead eventually, for persistent behaviour, to sacking. I think this is how RedBubble should handle it, in my opinion. I had thought legal action, but being that we’re global, this presents all sorts of problems – but that in a way demonstrates how very very serious I think this issue is.

In the past I’ve had bosses tell me to take bad and bullying behaviour ‘on the chin’. No one should EVER have to just wear it.

I think the way to deal with these people is to firstly use the report link and if that fails name the person publicly and explain the situation and let the cat out of the bag!
It seems to many people have trouble dealing with these threats and slandering and then hide the facts, so you don’t know who’s right or who’s wrong. Put it to us the public and let the person know this and then let us all have our point of view on the situation!!!!

I’ve only had this problem once or twice – and I used your tactic. Unfortunately one of the ‘perps’ got off on the attention and just made things worse. I haven’t used the ‘report’ button because I’m afraid RB will just tell me to get over it, essentially. I’d rather have doubts than know for sure they don’t care. LOL…. but that’s just me.

I think just ignore it. Don’t waste the energy on them.

Never gotten it. I’d just use the report button.
Let the RB people take care of it as they see fit. if they move on and do it to someone else, hopefully it gets reported.

I reported a work of ‘art’ I had issues with, and then left it to RB to make their own decision about it. I’d do the same with bubblemail. Replying just encourages them.

step 1: google “free porn”

step 2: insert email address of poohead to all “FREE 24/7 LIVE CHAT PLEASE ENTER EMAIL FOR FREE ACCOUNT NOW!!!!” websites

That is the mature way to deal with email attacks

With bubblemail, well I’m fairly anonymous , noone hates me yet…. it just hasn’t come up

Don’t you hate it when people hide behind the anonymity of electronic communications to vent. It is simply cowardly.
Just because it’s electronic that doesn’t make it less meaningful. People should have to stand by their words no matter what medium they use.
Out them Jo! And like Darren suggests, we can all share our points of view.

So far I’m seeing two main schools of thought here- report it or ignore it.

So let’s go one further, if we all report it- then what? What should RedBubble do about it?

Tell Ricky Ponting

Thats almost a legal concern and perhaps should be mentioned to police as that to me is indecent assault!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Exactly Anne. And Danny, a very astute observation!! Some ppl are amazingly clever at whipping ppl into a frenzy (no pun intended!) and garnering support with threats to remove themselves from the site after alleged criticism, and Jo, your mature attitude to this problem should be commended. Hang in there…I love what you do.

Sally

in my opinion, and I know I’ve already told you – if someone sends you sexually explicit, offensive material, especially “personalised”, I would inform the coppers.

You might think it’s just a sick joke, but it could be a sign of sexual deviancy that might be expressed in other unhealthy ways… more “direct” unhealthy ways. Folks like that gotta be dealt with by the professionals

Sorry Darren, I deleted that comment on you- thought it went a bit far.

Three strike system Jo. After three there out and can’t return to the bubble indefinately!

Hi Jo,
just curious, could the comment or email refer to your art work, or you personally,
ask this person to explain.
I find nothing wrong with your work or your profile.
My only guess why a person could possable send you an email as such would be because of the blood you sometimes show in your work. Dont get me wrong I find them great, ...yet i could see someone from the old school being a little drug down by the site of blood.,,, dont take what people say to heart on RB unless you feel they are threatning you personally…Ever one has a different taste in art and what you and I feel is great work others might feel it to be the indeferent or in bad taste.
That is the way the world works, but if you do feel personally threatened by someone dont hesatate by no means to report them, and have proper actions taken against them.
I love your work and am looking forward to seeing more of it.
cheers
Ruben

That particular example relates to a personal comment. I am much more lenient to criticism of my work which I realise goes against the flow in many cases. I am more concerned with personal attacks.

I sit possible to set up some type of ‘BLOCK’ to put on ppl you do not want comments/bubblemails from?

is it…i mean

I thankfully have not had to deal with this kind of behavior YET. I agree, report and ignore would be the favored tactics. I don’t think there should be a place for that kind of behavior in any forum, certainly not one where there is such a diversity of art forms and preference.

i have had a few nasties….some in appropriate remarks..but i just ignored them…and eventually they went away…i know thaTS probably not much help…but thats my personal experience..but i would say for the most part….. my experience on RB has been 99.999999% fantastic

such behavior is uncalled for and there is a need to STOP this… If someone really has a problem with what they see in others work; there is a kinda’ simple remedy DON’T LOOK anymore…(scabs of the world, an unfornate enity)...

i agrre completely with you solarrain

Jo, I had my share of nasties on Flickr. Ignore or Blocking them works, but some even go to the extent of creating fake multiple accounts. But I had to keep blocking the fake accounts. How I dealt with it is just report them and ignore. Don’t feed them by replying. Spend your energy on your passion Jo.

I agree with solarrain, if you don’t like what you see move on, and yea like someone said earlier it usually is a kid or something, ignoring them is the best solution, Ive seen a few redbubble “bullies” on here that leave some stupid journals about how all art on redbubble sucks except theirs (of course) ,(or something along those lines anyway) Some people have and will always continue to want their 15 minutes of fame even if it is negative fame. I wouldn’t let it bother you as I’m sure your not.

I’ve never had a nasty bm either … only from my friends and they don’t count.

Theoretically – I would NOT respond to the person and then would report it.

I reckon a three strikes and you’re out would work well – providing all the nasties were reported, and by that I mean complaints from three separate members.

I haven’t come across any negative comments or Bmail yet touch wood
I think the way you have said you have handled it in the past is very mature- commenting on someone’s art shouldn’t lead to personal attacks.

I think I’d be inclined to report it and let the ‘powers that be’ follow it up.

i’m gobsmacked that anyone would say that to you jo.

i’m with the three strikes and you’re out method. it’s fair enough they get some warnings that their behaviour is inappropriate but we shouldn’t have to put up with it indefinitely. if it was bad enough, i’d be thinking about blocking IP addresses, like you can do on forums.

Report them to big Arnie he’ll TERMINATE the F^*!ers.
I haven’t received anything like this as yet, BM or EM. if you report it to the RB staff I think they should terminate there membership. Get rid of them piss them off, we don’t need that here.

Just ignore them and be yourself. If we replied to all the people who have differing opinions and views to ours (even if they don’t have the skills to express that properly) we’d be feeding so many fires it’s not funny. Ignore and continue.

Some good points all.

One of the issues I’ve found is that it is very difficult to know and understand the truth in comments made, or to expect the intent behind a comment is the same that is received.

True, some comments are self explanatory – ‘your work sux’, or ‘you’re a loser’ etc. These should be reported and we need to know what action RB would take and to be kept informed at all statges and with reliable communication from RB. Others may simply prefer to report and forget. Blocking a person is an important option too. We all have different and preferred strategies. There needs to be a collection of ‘approved’ approaches to draw on.

The reality is that people’s interpretations of certain comments could be far from what the person sending the message intended (eg flippant and playful interpreted as attacking and derogatory – in which case the receiving party may need to reasses a few issues or at least engage in clarifying the issues in an adult way if possible).

This is expecially the case for this international site. Communication is so easy to misunderstand and misinterpret (even in the real world). Many of us are new to this and there’s a massive learning curve involved too (I think most of us are doing the best that we can and this needs to be acknowledged too). Then, given the concentrated and emotive nature of sites like this – escalation can easily happen and be fueled by everyone else who only have scant information about the situation. Its easy in this context to publicly and innapropriately vilify someone. This is just a word of caution for those that bay for public blood. I don’t necessarily agree.

I have mentioned elsewhere today that a system where people could debrief, seek clarification, dump, or generally get a few things of their chest before taking action can greatly assist. It would also send a strong message from RB to this virtual ‘community’ that they are actively providing support and avenues for distresses to be heard (a bit like the psychologist on the Australian version of Big Brother – most helpful to derail trauma and escalation in such an emotionally intense environment).

Ok that’s enuf ;)) Cheers Jo. Peace

Meet them face to face….. that usually shuts em up.

I like report and ignore. The e-mails you are describing are not just inappropriate, they are disturbing. They really throw up warning flags for me. Three strikes and you’re out might work, but I have seen many aliases pop up on this site. The person (s) might just change to a new identity.

I have read some of the comments here earlier and have resisted replying until I had fully considered what I would like to try and say..

OK.. it is a fact of life that there will always be someone out there who will go out of their way to be offended and, in turn feel the need to vent their moral indignation in a nasty, spiteful and gutlessly anonymous attack on someone because they don’t approve of the “values” of the person they are attacking.

I have copped this in the past (not on redbubble I hasten to add) and I choose, carefully and with a bit of anxiety, to do nothing… starve them of oxygen and allow them to fume away at the moon!! It will pass and you will be better prepared emotionally for the next time it happens..

abusive personal attacks ARE nasty, distressing and intimidating…. and bewildering… but thankfully they are usually few and far between and, if you ARE able to do something about it this time, what about the next time???

there also needs a line to be drawn somewhere as to the level or reaction to the intensity of the abuse and very simply if I thought I was being threatened with physical harm by someone too gutless to put his or her name to it then I would simply take it to the Police…...... you would be amazed at who they can find when they have to

what redbubble are able to do about this will be no doubt. carefully considered by RB head office

keep smilin’ Jo

It’s simply a matter of lower human development. Those people are afflicted by an inability to understand basic, common, social order and understanding the rest of us take for granted. Their unrealised suffering is punishment enough. Sooner or later they will all be bred out of existence.

if only it were that easy Murray!! :o)

Hi Jo. I think it’s an unfortunate but inevitable byproduct of “fame” (and you are famous, at least in RedBubble; can’t judge for the rest of the world). Once you’re in the spotlight, people have opinions on you. Good and bad. They have the freedom to express these, in public and in private mails. There’s nothing you can do about it, unless it becomes stalking. But that’s up to a judge to decide. You could go to court if you think it’s stalking.

However, best is to ignore it. Hatemail is perhaps better than being ignored completely. To quote a fellow-Australian: “People just ani’t no good, I think that’s well understood”.

My own view is that usually people who send those kind of things are after attention. They may not actually REALLY think what they say, but they say it to get a response. Many of them probably aren’t aware of their attention-seeking ways on a conscious level, but they are needy people who want someone to respond.

As a public figure, i too get the odd (thankfully) email from someone who is rude, obnoxious, or down-right dirty. I treat it like spam. Ignore and delete, and don’t be tempted to re-read it, or file it. It’s negative energy that will only niggle you, so toss it where it belongs. If everyone ignores this kind of behaviour, these folks (just like children) might find more productive ways to get noticed.

That is awful that you have to put up with such nonsense Jo – An absolute travesty!

I’m fortunate enough to have not received anything yet, but would use the report button as soon as I did.

I agree with Tania. The person who sends such a mail doesn`t know you personally, so you needn`t treat the note as personal. If that`s the way the person needs to get a buzz, then just pity him, report, delete, and move on.

I’m with Craig on this one, I think. Ignore it in the first instance, but if it persists, report. If it still continues after being reported, have the account deleted.

Hey Jo. I just ignore them completely most of the time. Normally they never say anything again. If it’s an instance where i’ve spoken to them once and that makes them think they’ve the right to be all sexual with me i put them in their place and they either apologise or disappear. I think, dealing with people myself rather than reporting them, unless it’s at the stage where I just can’t anymore, takes the pressure off redbubble. Just being honest with them works for me. Recently this quote has helped me along

The people that mind don’t matter. The people that matter don’t mind.

It can be applied liberally to life! This post is hggledy piggledy but I hope you understand what i’m saying!
Mel x

I think that you should always report mail and comments that concern you. It should be the concern of RedBubble to effectively police the site and ensure that standards are maintained. The community can only exist as long as the members follow the etiquet guidelines. If you don’t follow the guidelines there has to be a consequence.

Who ARE these people? no-one sends me shit like that…

Dave – get your boobs out and then see what happens ;p

hey jo that is beyond innapropriate i would just have their accounts removed however there is no said way to stop them coming back.They can just sign up again.Maybe rb should become membership only for the photographers?maybe they are just jealous because of many said reaons… anywho sorry hear this is going on!!!!!¡¡¡¡

Ditto ALL the above….if that fails send to me! I have a licence to ^%$**

One option to consider: if you must reply, adopt the lines:

“If you don’t like it, don’t browse it. The kittens can be found here: http://www.redbubble.com/search/find/?search%5Bsearch%5D=kitten&search%5Bhidden_search%5D= “

What is really bad is the people who do nothing and just leave. That leaves a bully getting away with it, and most likely will target someone else, and one less artist here.

it usually the girls getting picked on…my boobs are out right now

1, Ignore them and report to RB straight away
2, Name and Shame them, expose them for what they really are.
Can’t believe people are so insecure about themselves and so small minded that they send childish BM’s….
Keep Smiling Jo….Hugs, Debbi x

I agree with Deborah Bowness, but I will copy and paste the offending mail, into a journal, so people can see what exactly has been written.

This site is a wonderful place for artistic expression….Artistic expression comes in many forms….For those who can’t tolerate the openess, they should leave through the back door…

Id report them, if it was offensive enough. I once had a model in melbourne who decided that she didnt like my ex bf who she had worked with and then when i wouldnt take sides with her views on him, she turned on me. Wasnt on here, was DA but the public comments about who i slept with, my child, my family and my work were enough to report her, got her banned and funnily enough has dissapeared into oblivion.

there is a time and place for critiques however blatent, but public slanging matches are a no no.

Rebecca

hmm… if they got to the point of annoying me I’d report them straight away, and let the bubble admin deal with the psychos. However, generally this sort of mail are a source of priceless fun to me, and usually worth a good laugh. Mind you, I don’t get that many though, and never on Redbubble – I suspect because my work isn’t provocative enough.
I wouldn’t mind you posting the new adjectives you get on your journals every once in a while. I’m sure people’ll have fun reading them :)

I’m just blown away by this kind of behaviour. It’s not like bubblemails can be sent anonymously.
A ‘block user’ feature could be useful…if someone is being rude or weird, we could add their name to a list of members we want no bmails or comments from. We could add/remove names at any time.
Guess that’s a bunch of coding for RB to do though.

Gday Jo, I had no idea any nast stuff was going on on this site, I have always felt comfortable and have received nice complements.
These people obviously haven’t seen my pics if they think you’re untalented. I think you’re very pretty and you’re shots are fantastic.
If I were to receive any nasty mail I would definetly report it.
Cheers Rhys

That’s not nice at all for this to happen to you Jo. I used to get lots on my facebook account and that was because the person got my name mixed up with someone else and wouldn’t believe me when I said they got the wrong person. I had to disable the account in the end.

I’ve dealt with a lot of name calling in my line of work and it’s very hard to not feel emotional about it. You’re being attacked, simple as that, and if you don’t take a moment to step away and do something else to calm yourself and think logically. Well, it can be so easy to reply with a comment just as cutting.

I can see lots of people have offered great suggestions on technical level that could counter this.

On a emotional level, my advice would be. Do step away from the pc and do something else for a few minutes. If you can’t, take a few deep breaths to feel calm and don’t respond. Rather notify the administrators for action. If a response is given, it may start a chain reaction which could spiral out towards others.

Just my view.

Jo, you know a little bit about me, and you know what I do for a living…. and you haven’t sent me these peoples addresses as yet???

Just kidding.

Commended should you be in regards to your attitude and maturity regarding this situation.
Do report it and try not to respond to it.
If it continues (2 to 3 or more times) then that falls into the category of harrassement. The situation then can be reported to an authority who will give you direct and correct advice on how to handle the situation.

It makes me feel “down in the dumps” for you and also to others who have had to deal with this new age electronic bullying and harrasement.

Yeah, Paul could pay a visit…or I could unleash my scariest beast…

My question now would have to be what action should redbubble take if someone reports a nasty bubblemail?

Everything on this site gets logged, and the admin people have access to whatever they want. How about:
If Party A reports Party B for being abusive, admin contacts Party B to let them know their actions on the site (comments, forum posts and bmails) are being monitored. They receive a second sterner warning for doing it again to ANYONE not necessarily Party A, and the third time their account is cancelled.
Doesn’t stop them creating a new account tho…guess there’s not much we can do about that kind of determination!

Hi Jo
I am coming in a bit late but i really wanted to think about this because my gut reaction was ‘outrage and hurt’ for you and was going to say name them shame etc but i am not really that type of person. However, after thinking long and hard I think the best thing is to report them to redbubble and ignore them – they are the one with the problem – not you. They have a warped sense of moral outrage – i cannot believe people still get outraged over nudity – maybe they should look at Melinda Kerr’s latest image and see whether their anger and outrage could be channeled to better use. Keep doing what you are doing and let RB deal with.
As for how should RB deal with – well depends upon the severity of the abuse I suppose – warning and for the real nasty then their accounts should be deleted – nobody would put up with threatening behaviour in the ‘real’ world so why tolerate it in the ‘virtual’.
Debxxx

Does the bubble go for a “Zero Tolerence” policy in regards to electronic abuse?
Wouldn’t be a bad thing.

Zero tolerance- interesting. But does that make it too easy for people to cry wolf?

This site, in my opinion, has the highest level of maturity, intelligence and creativity of all the social sites I have dappled in. Most are 50-90% just plain innocent, and immature crap. So to here this at all is sad. I am a new bubbler, as you say, and I have only read about 5 comments here plus your entry Jo, and the last one here from Paul Louis V is the best of twhat I got so far, it sounds sound and stress reducing. Rise above it. 1. Let it go 2. Take note and say stop. 3. Take action and let the RB Report button or the pros have it.

I really find Red Bubble an amazing place to create. I am having a unique and creative adveture here. And I am sharing my work here rather than living in fear of this because it is just that creatively rich here. Step three sucks, (I know) who wants to go there. Maybe the best way is to use the terms and conditions thing,—but open is open. So from my new horizon here, I think the “original content only” is your safety key to a quality environment; one that amazingly maintains this level of free expression.

Jerks are just committing crimes against their own art. But … then agian that might be an art form … this site is amazing. The arts rock! The other advantage to redbubble is age. Artist without a body of work are kids. And other sites seem to have bigger issues, which in the long run waters down their creative freedoms. Stuff like internet porn machines, and the sex slave industries ads in disguise, and pedophiles are the big issues. So far, from my point of view, you guy got it on. And the arts are all the hope we have in the world gone … this is enough … I love you guys. Take care. —C.C. Arshagra

I think the guys at RB are rational and would deal with this in a mature way – i had to report a comment – I actually laughed (which is unlike me as i am very sensitive) but it wasn’t personal – it was before the delete option – I got a great email from the guys and we laughed it off. It doesn’t take too much to work out those who ‘cry wolf’ etc

no one has ever really sent me anything nasty
but i think i would just ignore it
you know like every other art criticism i’ve ever gotten
its sometimes worth a look into the criticism itself
but not usually
i think it would do better for you to just ignore and continue
there are four letter words to describe censors like the ones your discussing…...and the others discussing this

Jo – I have only had one instance when someone attacked me in public in a journal , because of a misunderstanding, having to due with Group Bubble Mails and what was going on with the group.

They decided it was best to write a journal about what they thought they were being treated unfairly when it came to the group. But they didn’t read the two BubbleMails that were sent out.

They didn’t take it up with me first or any buddy at RedBubble first they went straight to their journal and talked about how much a SNOB i was and how i laughed at their artwork. Both of these being TOTALLY untrue.

Their friends took their side of course without reading anything in my public replys to these attacks and then attacked me in public and private

Then they admit in the journal they suffer from despression and didn’t take their meds??

People need to releaze when your mad , Don’t go on the Internet

If you unfortunately suffer from any kind of sickness please make sure your taking your meds cause none of us want to see anyone get sick or hurt.

When you attack someone on the internet openly apologizing privately is only doing half the job you attacked them publicly you need to apologize publicly.

Other then this incident I have never had any bad experiences

My 2 cents

You know what Jo I love your work and I love the fact it has provoked a reaction. You should too, it’s all part and parcel of being an artist dealing with the subject matter your dealing with in the way you deal with it.

Have you heard of Damien Hurst, he is an English based artist that has made his name from pissing off people left, right and centre. When Damien Hurst cut a cow in half and froze it in formaldehyde
he got hell of a lot of abuse from many sections of society. However, it didn’t bother him because ultimately he wanted to provoke a reaction, good or bad. In a sense he believes a reaction is better than no reaction at all if you are an artist. This controversy that he has created around his work that has lead to us still talking about him.

Personally I would say take it as a complement that you have wound some people up and got them talking about your work. But the price you pay is you have pissed some people off and on the internet you will never escape their opinions about you. In the end the more well known you become the more thick skinned you’ll need to become, that’s life I’m afraid.

Well, I haven’t had any truly offensive bubblemails, (although I had a group moderator outright tell me my work sucked, but that’s another matter) but I did have someone steal my work to create another piece of their own without my permission. I first contacted that person and very diplomatically asked them to remove the work. He went on about his crusade against the confines of copyright, etc… He, in turn, took my avatar and put a bar across it and put my bubblemail in the description. At this point I reported it to redbubble. Less than a month later he did it again. I reported it again and redbubble said even if they deleted his account he could just create another. They said they would be implementing a block user button in the near future. That was the last I’d heard of that.

Hi Jo I would say try to put something in place where multiple offenders have there account deleted. More or less one time you get slapped on the wrist.
2nd time you have you account deleted. That is a good penalty cause you put all the work into your account just to have it deleted.

Best thing to do is report the comments to redbubble and do not reply to it.
If you reply to it you refuel that persons ego. And they go attack someone else.

Hi JO…Definitely agree with Jeff above….however (to turn the experience into something you can actually have fun with)….my personal preference would be to hand out a good verbal slap – I have noticed that in the forums if a dodgy remark is made and then handed back in kind the idiot/bully either runs off or delivers abject apologies/excuses (bullies hate being laughed at). Forums have the advantage of being public. What I would suggest is that following a nasty bm you respond with a mixture of polite ironic sarcasm drawing attention to:

a) the miniscule size of the senders brain (or penis, if applicable)
b) the lack of any intellectual reasoning in their argument
c) grammatical errors in their sentence structure
d) the lack of any artistic merit in their work (really nasty)
e) the utter pointlessness of their existence
f) the damaged psycho-pathology they clearly suffer from (refer here to disturbing incestuous incidents that have obviously taken place in their childhood)

You could also ask them for an in depth critique of your work that you would like to publish alongside the whole correspondence between you as an incorporation into your latest post modern ironic artwork entitled ‘why my art sucks’ – This then elevates the bullying to the level of art, thus proving that you are a much nicer and more artistic person than the arsehole in question.

In the meantime, in reply to ‘you are disgusting’ send the response
‘I am delighted to see that you have not allowed your ignorance to stand in the way of your prejudices.’
(This should get the ball rolling and throw the moron into a state of confusion to start with) …….x….k

You guys have raised the issue about when the bubble deletes an account then the person can just join up again under a different user name! I’m sure there is a way that the bubble can identify the person by their ip address or even by their art so that they can stop or delete the account once that triggers? I have just seen a nasty comment again and i am shocked it is here

cant they be tracked through their browser like ban their ip address then if that doesnt work report them to their service providers and the police?

Wow Jo, that’s horrid. I have to admit, I’ve never had a bubblemail that was bad – ever (uh, at least none I thought was that bad).

I’m not sure how I’d respond – most likely I’d just hit the “DELETE” button, or possibly send them an image of a standard “ignore” button and let it go.

Considering some of the remarks you’ve received though I’d be tempted to use the report button – I don’t see why people wouldn’t use it if they thought the occasion warranted it…isn’t that what it’s for?

Most sites have a way of tracking people through their IP addresses, don’t they have that here? Even other forums I moderate on have that and there have been occasions where’ we’ve had to ban an IP address along with the user.

I don’t think a zero tolerance policy is fair if there is no proof. If there is proof I don’t know who is the right person/s to be the jury. If you have a three strikes policy which would seem fairer with a warning system for the accused then maybe. If someone is sending these bmails and then gets kicked out who then is to know who they are when they come back as someone else. Sorry I do think something should be done but I am not sure what and I am more concerned about the people who are receiving this abuse as at the moment there seems to be a lot of it about? It would be very sad if someone is putting up with this just to stay on the site or if they have left because of it.
Not much help sorry. As for the person who thinks you are disgusting Jo, there are many many more who do not.

Holy moly, I didn’t think people would stoop to that level – obviously I’ve never had a nasty bubblemail :.

I think you’re on the right track with your tactics. I’d let them know what they’ve said is inappropriate, but instead of threatening to publish it, I’d just report it. Life’s too short to deal with people who never learnt that you attract more bees with honey ;)

Sorry – I commented before reading everyone else’s comments! Firstly, I think RB should have some kind of abuse cop. Said abuse cop could record strikes against people’s name – three and you’re out!

i think people who do this should have their email address blocked from red bubble and their names so they cannot apply again using their real details, but they can obviously just go and make another…

I’ve never had any of these. Is there a perticular pattern? the obvious to me would seem nudes?

Hi Jo – there’s too much to read here(other commetns) – so I’m just going to say what I feel to respond to your dilemma – which sounds horrid – poor thing!

Firstly – what cowards some people are! To actually harass and bully behind the scenes and then prance around as if they are mr or mrs or ms nice – with such holier-than-thou airs about them – how dare they?!

I think when you are feeling threatened and intimidated in any way whatsoever from something that somebody is telling you and it has left you feeling anxious hurt or in some cases sadly, distraught – then there’s no question that this is bullying and harassment!

It’s so sad that some people don’t realise that all they have to do is exercise their right to either view or not view and leave others to do the same!! IF ONLY!!! and mind their own business!

I guess what’s really sad is how little bullies realise, that expression of an individual’s personality, sexuality and sensuality are the most liberating things on earth! If only they set themselves free from their own personal traps and concentrate on their own happiness….they wouldn’t feel such a need to condemm others perhaps….perhaps that’s wishful thinking!

I know of a case where an individual on RB opened a second account – a different folio – (less conservative images than the primary account) – and was bmailed repeatedly by another RB person who in no uncertain terms made their disapproval known and sent several harassing bmails culminating in a threat to reveal the identity…..the way it was all done was horrible for the person receving this. And i know for a fact that this person felt extremely distressed by this.

Jo – you have my FULL SUPPORT in reporting them and exposing bullying for what it is – a cowardly and cruel tactic intended to undermine an individual and give the bully a sense of power (very sad and very false of course!)

I guess Jo, at the end of the day – YOU are comfortable with your body, your expression, your sensuality and are happy to display and express yourself artistically and creatively…GOOD ON YOU! You rock! and I am proud of you (not just because we’re cousins lol!)

Keep up your amazing work and talent !!!

hugs to you Jo
love
Suzanne xoxo

Everyone has the right to free expression, but some just take that right to ean they can dog people for no reason, label them with false names etc. I am a great believer in free opinion. I for one will only comment on issues that effect my beliefs or family. People should keep non constructive critisism to themselves if it does not help another person in the future to better oneself in the act of betterment. I have not used the report nor will I, the opinion is a great thing, just people abuse it as a staging point for shit. Instead of having a report, why not have an ignore button for those that dont like to report or do not wish to, like myself. Anyhow, keep up the good work you do Jo, always a pleasure to see.
Ian
88

So much has been written here to you post that just about every angle has been covered. My thought, use the proper authorities and report the problem. There are a lot of pseudointellectuals out there. Unfortunately, they express themselves when they should not. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Don’t ever let anyone change the way you view your art. I would just ignore the ignorant, they will go away if you don’t respond to them. keep doing what you love to do. Constructive criticism is good, it is constructive. Others who bash people are just insecure and probably are as untalented as they are ignorant. Let it go. You know who your friends are. they are the ones that count.

Oh, I think there should be a panel at redbubble and not just one person to decide on removal of offenders from the site. That way it is more objective as a collective rather that putting that kind of responsibility on one individual.

Just to clarify here guys- I am not referring to comments about my work. I am referring to personal comments about me, my personality etc. Comments about my work are often negative and that doesn’t bother me at all. Telling me my work is disgusting is fine, because much of it is. Telling me that I am disgusting is not!

What should redbubble? My advice is this:

1) You need a fair and well-publicised process for dealing with these matters. Clear standards of acceptable and unacceptable behaviour and a clear process for dealing with breaches. In ‘normal’ society we have laws, bylaws and courts. RB needs something equivalent although not nearly as complex. It’s the principle of the issue, more so than the practice.

2) This information should form part of the sign-on terms and conditions for new members, and all existing members should be directly informed via a Bubble mail, site publicity and also email (if you have such information) of the update to the T&C.

3) There should be a well-publicised and easily accessed complaint process. ie: the link to send a message to the adjudicator should appear at the top of each page, no matter where the member is browsing.

4) The process should include an impartial person(s) to assess complaints. A timeframe for dealing with these should also be stated, and regular updates to the complainer given (as often they will be distressed). Guidelines need to be in place to tell the complainer what they need to do in order to make the complaint.

The concept of ‘offensive’ behaviour should be clearly defined, although recognising that you can never give a definitive list – examples, general standards etc.

5) The ‘punishment’ should be very clearly publicised: options could include the aggressor’s RB account being cancelled, fines being issued with funds taken from earnings (if the aggressor has earnings on account), publication of the offense (it happens in courts), blocking of ISP etc.

6) On other boards I take part in, we are able to block people from sending us private messages (BMs). You get one nasty message, and then you block them. RB should offer this function.

We can all go blue in the face trying to understand these people. We can all say that if you don’t like what you see, then turn off the computer – there’s no need to attack and be vile. But it’s not about that for these people. It’s about attention and intimacy and connection with the object of their misguided desires (and I use the word desire not necessarily in a sexual context).

It will not solve the problem. I personally like the name and shame approach – I remember that there was a tailor in Carlton who would put a list in their window of all the customers who ordered expensive suits and never paid for or collected them. So anyone could walk by and see who these people were. I’m not sure of the legality of this practice now though.

I think that these bottom dwellers exist in a world of darkness of their own making. They create an intimacy between themselves and their victim (Jo, in this case). It is a nice cosy little world until the light of day is shone on it and the intimacy is broken. That’s the key IMHO.

I think what Jo is saying is right…to embark on a personal onslaught and drive a nail into somebody else (for any reason) instead of just being specific about what it is they are criticising in the artwork or images or writing or whatever it is they dislike….well that’s not on – at all!

also…Melissa’s comment about the people that mind don’t matter and the people that matter don’t mind – makes good sense!

well jo, after you report them and it keeps up..you can borrow our vice president..he will just come over and take em out..n go shoot em :D
serious issue, just dont understand people now-a-days, i know overall life trying to make a living is a bitch, however, taking it out on another, still doesnt solve their problem..it just created a new one

I totally get that people are pissed off by this kind of behavior, I just keep wondering about what should happen after you hit the ‘report’ button- what is a fair process to follow.

ok I used to moderate an international web forum once for the ABA – Australian Breastfeeding Association…I used to get in the middle of some mighty nasty stuff at times….and well…sometimes after tactfully and privately asking that people back off …I mean all of us Counsellors were only doing there to help not to be abused and have weirdos being derrogatory…(and some of those were women btw not just men!)...

well then I would just tell them I was removing them from the site…and that was that. At the end of the day they have to choose how to behave and are accountable for not only their behaviour but the impact they are having on others…

choose to be reasonable, fair and leave people alone…let moderators etc do their job…or continue harassing and accept the consequences…..and be removed – their choice!

I think that’s fair enough – a couple of warnings should be more than enough! (If they persist and are unrea\sonable that is).

Suzanne

its real simple as what is to be done jo, by the admin after the report button has been hit, do the three strikes and you’re out rule
first, they get a notice their Bubblemail has been reported, and strongly suggest they dont send anymore like that out
second, they get another notice, this time informing them..if it happens again..they will be removed off the site completely
third….remove them..simple…id suggest blocking IP addy so they cant make up fake names so they can come back and harrass more
so three strikes..and you’re out !

Sorry to hear you are getting nasty emails Jo…abuse and offensive comments should not be tolerated – report them.

sorry

have not time to read all these through

nasty bubblemails…..NOT ME/life tooo short/ I have a habit of saying how it is and not behind curtains.

Even creating behind a profile photo/this is no secret and never really meant to be/my surname is attached to profile and sure my name in the phone book

In life no one can hide!

Jo/ think I would just get over it and read and then delete/worse things will happen in life.

....looks around for the “why the hell is this person on RedBubble, flam their sorry ass” button… hmmm… We deal with it on DPS in the following manour… “ignore, ignore, block” .....then, we could always send “chopper” around, with a message…

Blocking IP address’s doesn’t work. The only way to get rid of someone would be to block their whole ISP. So then you would block off thousands of posible customers.

Blocking one person’s IP address doesn’t work cause there are several different ways to change your IP address aswell.

Using just the REPORT button means that Joe Blow hits it and then gets two friends to Hit it and if its 3 strikes then your out. Thats not fair either.

There has to be proper proof and intent. Not just some misunderstanding.

Well first Jo ya too sexy to say bad about.
I find being in the art world that the people that do have a pinch on you are usually jealous in some way.
But hey if that really is pissin’ ya off a good old drive by with a automatic firearm does the trick.
LOL
Na really they are twats and I just move on, it takes all kinds to make the world spin.

I tells ya, abuse really needs to be thoroughly covered in the Terms of Service. Check out how Live Journal adress abuse – heaps of people think that lj abuse itself is abusing their power, however, they’re on the money with the intention.

I haven’t been unfortunate enough to get any abusive bubblemails myself (give it time), but I feel that you probably only get them because:

a) You’re a good photographer, and a lot of small-minded people out there will get jealous and say anything they like to put off the competition.

b) You’re work is very open and spirited and, believe it or not, there are folks out there with nothing better to do than trawl the internet looking for things that offend their small-town sensibilities (people with fulfilling sex-lives, optimism and complete lack of guilt are their biggest ‘buttons’), just so they can have something to rant about.

My best advice would be to do everything you can to show these people up – hopefully it will put them off. But, when it does happen, I’d say the best thing is to try to be happy about the fact that you are evidently offending people who deserve to be offended.

Take care. x

I report things like this straight away, including any replies that I may have sent. :)

I obviously don’t send abuse back as I don’t believe in stooping to their level.

This proves how petty minded some people are by negating you rather than your work.

It also goes to show your art is getting noticed, getting a reaction, which in a way (albeit sometimes a not very nice one) is a good thing. You’re there to provoke thoughts and responses, the majority of which are inspiring and intellectual, its the few that ruin it for the many.

this sort of stuff should not be occuring.

maybe push the report button..

sorry to hear your getting these types of emails.. hopefully they stop.

ive had nasty emails when people thoguht they were missing out on the montage videos ive been making (in fact Jo, we discussed this), but ive never had an unprovoked, or random abusive email…
how common is this??

You’re handling it right, Jo. And, it seems to me, people only fear what they don’t understand. Maybe they can’t relate to your obvious talent? ;-) Who the hell cares anyway, you’re not in it for them. I know it hurts to hear those things, though. Regardless of how intelligently you react. It’s tempting to come back with equal force, but I think you’re wiser to go the higher ground. I would report them though!!!! Absolutely! There really isn’t any room left in the world for these judgmental F*&^cks! To peace, love, tolerance, and and open mind!

Hi Jo,

I believe that we should all try to get things out into the open. If someone wants to be passionate with their views I feel they should put it in the public forum. Then you have an opportunity to answer them in a public forum. Personally If I am confronted by something written to me I endeavour to get to the depth of my emotion and reply honestly from the heart.