Credit = FIRE
I have been thinking for days just what to say about the economic crisis facing the USA and soon the world. Credit was a fairly recent invention in history and easy credit even more recent. Unfortunately rich people soon realized they did not have to do much work if they just “loaned” enough people enough money. The resulting inflationary spending and speculation soon raised the value of their stocks and real estate. One no longer had to work and save, or create something special people wanted that was new and useful. All you had to do to “make money” was make more of it. But credit is like fire, and it has now torched the banking system. Burned it to the ground.
Who is to Blame?
Who said no one need watch this fire?
Who said it was a OK to put all the fuel we have into the fire?
Who’s job is it to make sure the fire does not destroy the shelter it was designed to warm up?
Follow the money and we see that the few who have retained their ill gotten gains are not being asked to share in the task of rebuilding the bank system. No they have asked the tax payer to foot the bill. (in the USA that is not the rich) We just said no, we don’t want to. The government has never seemed so powerless, in it’s response to the CEOs who are saying” If I lose my millions your nation will lose trillions”. There it is. The powers that be have been corrupted to the point that they can no longer function properly.
They have all of us over a barrel. We all will end up paying for averting our eyes when we believed that easy money was real money.
Meanwhile “they” say the same stuff, watch out for higher taxs’s, socialism is the enemy, and the people we fight in Iraq are who we really need to fear.
If you believe this still to be true after your pension, savings and job disappear. You need to look in the mirror.
divareVeur
Weeee hoooo you go Mtnman! so true!
Mark Ramstead replied
Yeah it is!
atomikboy
Doesn’t China like own mega of your treasury bonds too?......and I heard the Saudi’s are like buying your fucking ports…......what’s going on!!!!!
Mark Ramstead replied
Yes the whole world is in on it. But they are asking the American taxpayer to pay for it… I would die in this war willingly…
divareVeur
everything in amerika is for sale to the highest bidder didn’t you know! We are whores… and that give whores a bad name! lol
Mark Ramstead replied
Capitalism was a powerful system when there was room and materials to grow. But with everything becoming to expensive to own, they started to sell fear instead, fear of all kinds.
atomikboy
What war?.........
Mark Ramstead replied
A revolt against greed.
atomikboy
Amen 2 that!!!!!.....
headfux
rockerfellas and the rothschilds are buying out all the banks and brain washing everyone through the media here
Mark Ramstead replied
Thanks caroline, I have been watching it…
BrainCandy
Who is to blame? Good question!
Did you vote for the Socialist Alliance? Of course not! Nobody does, and then when things go arse up, everyone bitches about the executives, capitalism gone mad, unfairness of it all…
So I guess it’s the society’s fault. For being greedy, always wanting more, always looking for a quick buck – that’s exactly what the corporations do, it’s just that they do it BETTER than an average Joe.
Mark Ramstead replied
Elections are not a census, they are an application of power. Not everybody can be rich, but one party continues to promise just that.
Anne McGinn
You summed it friendo – in so many well put words – we are fucked.
Mark Ramstead replied
friendo… You are so cool.
Anne McGinn
Only if you say so :))
Arletta
ahem Speaking as a former employee of Consumer Credit Counseling Services of America, I can tell you that credit is not the problem. It is a lack of maturity and responsibility, coupled with complex issues of greed and belief that want equals need.
We had many persons in debt because someone lost their job, and they were still trying to maintain their lifestyle. Or they were living beyond their means to impress others. Some of those people spent $6,000.00 or more a month, but their rent was $1,000 and their food bill was $800 The rest was luxuries and entertainments, including classes for the kids, vacations, $100 or more a plate charity dinners, etc.
I’m all for charity, mind you, but if you can’t pay your own bills, sometimes the most charitable thing to do, for the country at large, is to get yourself under control
Some of those people filed for bankruptcy. Now, sometimes bankruptcy is, in fact, the only choice a person has because of actual disaster. But, attending too many parties and having too much fun is not the sort of reason a person should need to file. There is such a thing as paying the piper. If you make such a huge debt, you should pay it.
Consumer Credit Counseling Services main goal is to educate persons about what not paying bills, even if you are legally freed from them by filing for bankruptcy, does to this country. It forces your creditors to raise the costs of their products, the government to raise taxes, and therefore effects the whole country.
They are big on teaching people about budgeting and moderation. Most of the people that pass through their doors have more than enough money to live a very comfortable lifestyle, but not the way they’ve let themselves live it.
I would urge anyone who is having problems paying their bills to contact their local Consumer Credit Counseling Service office. There are other such agencies, but, this is one I know is legitimate. They will draw up a budget plan for you, proposals of a payment schedule to send to your creditors and, if possible, enter into an agreement with all parties to help you pay off your debt at a reduced interest rate and where you will, more than likely, have to pay a much smaller monthly fee than usual. There is a small fee, $20 per month last I heard, to help cover some of the costs of mailing and their work but they usually spend a great deal more than that .. and they almost always save a great deal more than that for their clients.
It won’t be easy, and you will have to give up your credit cards until your debts are paid,; but, in the end, you will have taken responsibility for your actions and you can hold your head up high; you’ll have learned some valuable lessons and strategies (if you needed to learn them), and you’ll be helping your entire country.
Mark Ramstead replied
At the bottom of the social spectrum, people have some responsibility to pay their bills. My focus however is that the banks loaned money to people who could not pay back the loans, unless the speculative market continued to go up. It did in fact go up for a very long time. Four years ago I felt the home prices were already way to high. Yet it continued, the loans continued, and the people who said this was OK made tremendous profits. Those people have not been asked to pay for this mess, in fact those people are the ones who are asking the tax payers to pay the bill. This issue is so very complicated and so much of our economic system is based on trust, that the cons in this game are counting on us to trust them at least this one last time.
People, all of us have been living beyond our means for a long time and in varying degrees. My beef is that the profiteers will not pay for it but the bottom rung of the ladder will. Economic slavery is what this is really about. The granite counter top in your kitchen does not mean you are among the plantation owners in this story….
Arletta
Ah, but it doesn’t mean your not. Nor does it mean that, if you are the sort of person who lives on a moderate income, but are still living beyond your means, that you are not.
It’s a two way street, when the loans are taken out! It’s still a two way street when someone wants to bail out on their bill. And, companies have the same options to seek ways to pay their creditors with reduced interest, etc. as anyone else does.
Bottom line: we are all people, and all people have the responsibility to not run up their debts; and, if they fail in that responsibility, to take action to pay them.
You can’t change the world, except by changing yourself and setting it a darned good example to follow. The greedy will always be at the top, looking down at the poor they created. But, if you do things right, maybe, just maybe, some of the ones at the top will look down and see the people, not the stepping stones.
Mark Ramstead replied
I suspect that both you and I live within our means. I do. I won’t spell it out, but my concern with this crisis is what will happen to my money. Will it be devalued in any way? If so why am I being made to pay for others who have speculated?
Farmncamera
How is it that Barney Frank, and the like, keep pushing Fannie and Freddie into making bad loans, so they can look good, then, those bad loans default…. NO wonder that it has come to a grinding halt! But why is NOTHING EVER said….about Mr. Frank? He should be thrown out of government and never show his face ever again!! And YES….greed, greed and more greed! Well, NO WONDER they want to throw the 10 commandments out of EVERYTHING that has to do with Government!!!??? “Thou shalt NOT steel”..... Yes, who wants to look at their sins every day, and be reminded. Best re-think WHY the government does the things it does….And as for fixing this…. there is NO fix..unless people repent and get back to the morals it was founded on…..and a cold day in Hell will have to happen before that happens. Well, so long..it’s been nice!!!!! Laugh at morals….God, and laugh us out of THIS mess!! Get ready for a dictator….. Russia, N. Korea or Iran…..they would all like to get their hands on this country…
Mark Ramstead replied
I am not sure it has come to that just yet. But yes they all would like to take over our country, just like we did when we took it over from the Indians. Finding a moral solution sounds good to me in any case.
Farmncamera
Me too, if it were possible….
Arletta
Good gracious man, if I lived within MY means I’d be out on the street wondering how much it would cost to buy a good sized cardboard box to shelter myself in. lol But, I am not taking out any loans, certainly.
didg
Nice thread Mtn.
I live well within my means.
I’ve always said (and maybe we had this discussion at work, before) it is impossible for everyone to be rich. If everyone was rich, it would mean that everyone was financially equal. When everyone is equal, isn’t that the dreaded socialism?
No one ever talks about that. There always has to be a working class and even a poor class, for there to be a rich class.
Whatever.
I’m not even gonna pretend to know what this mess is all about.
I’m just trying to stay out of it.
How are you, Mr Mtn?
I heard some not too cool info on the news tonight.
Is it true?
Samantha Bla Bla
Way to go . You hit this one hard!!!
Phineous Cas...
well said dude greed isa bitch that needs to die a painfull death before theres total chaos
Earhart Chappe...
too many words from me on this subject, cheers to you for getting it out!~chappel